tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5331156725554508589.post7555125161397257142..comments2023-10-04T05:09:54.848-05:00Comments on Contra Mundum: The Leopard Has Not Changed Its SpotsAndyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02908788730958708701noreply@blogger.comBlogger2125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5331156725554508589.post-2094662957720949122010-11-09T21:34:23.291-06:002010-11-09T21:34:23.291-06:00Shepherd,
Thanks for your well thought out respon...Shepherd,<br /><br />Thanks for your well thought out response. Be assured that my delayed response was not from an unwillingness to address any issue you raised. I have been thinking this through for a few days and hope I can at least clear it up a little.<br /><br />I have no problem with the idea that Christians should hold political leaders accountable. I don’t care to open the “state-church” can of worms. Holding them accountable is a far cry however from working to manipulate them or siding with corrupt and evil regimes to further your own agenda. <br /><br />I doubt that any Roman Catholic would claim that Rome has changed. To their mind they’ve never been wrong so they see no reason to change. If they were never wrong in the first place, they need not change. (I will not address the historically demonstrable fact that this is false.) The notion that Rome hasn’t changed is the constant refrain of evangelicals who are eager to join in ecumenical activity with Rome. We are urged to forsake the principles of the Reformation because Rome is not the same as she was during the days of the Reformers. <br /><br />I don’t see a problem in citing bishops and popes from 50+ years ago because 50 years ago is not ancient history. We all have relatives who lived through these events. What Rome did during WWII is what she did during medieval history.<br /><br />I don’t know if this clears up anything. <br /><br />AndyAndyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02908788730958708701noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5331156725554508589.post-17296246713423229472010-11-06T10:24:12.220-05:002010-11-06T10:24:12.220-05:00I'm afraid I don't quite fully understand ...I'm afraid I don't quite fully understand your critique of Rome here. And I'm a Reformed Calvinist, not a Catholic by the way.<br /><br />First, even if you disagree with how Rome has applied this power (and you cite some notable misuses), do you not agree that the Church has some right to hold political figures and regimes accountable? John Knox, Martin Luther, and the Scottish Covenanters all believed this. You may or may not believe this as well; I won't presume to put words in your mouth.<br /><br />Second, I'm sure Catholics could respond by pulling out a great deal of crazy, misguided, erroneous, and dangerous statements from Protestants throughout the past - Protestants from positions of great authority. I won't bother to compile a grand selection of quotes, but just look at the giants of Protestantism and you'll find some wacky and saddening stuff. <br /><br />Or, to respond on another tack - look at Roman Catholic quotes and you'll find some uncooky, right-on, biblically consistent, brilliant quotes as well - even ones that work against the quotes you've provided above. Catholics are, after all, a big group... over <i>one billion people</i>. And they aren't as unified on every subject as folks tend to assume.<br /><br />Third, you seem to be addressing the "inane appeal that Rome has changed." I won't comment on that, since I'm no expert on current Roman Catholic interactions with politics. But wouldn't you be better served in making whatever point you are trying to make by citing CURRENT Roman Catholic bishops and popes, rather than popes and bishops "from the first 50+ years of the twentieth century?" There are whole Protestant denominations that aren't even that old and have changed remarkably in their history! I'm not convinced that you can assert that Rome is still the same and then prove it with historical, not current quotes.<br /><br />Thanks for your passion for defending the faith and doctrinal truth; I am sympathetic to your disgust with the papal tyranny of the past. I just feel your post above contains more opinion than solid argumentation.<br /><br />Peace,<br />ShepherdShep Shepherdhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16019902307959923395noreply@blogger.com